____                          _                 _____       ___     _  ___   ___  ___  
|  _ \  ___  ___ ___ _ __ ___ | |__   ___ _ __  |___ /      / _ \   / |/ _ \ ( _ )/ _ \ 
| | | |/ _ \/ __/ _ \ '_ ` _ \| '_ \ / _ \ '__|   |_ \ ____| (_) |  | | (_) |/ _ \ (_) |
| |_| |  __/ (_|  __/ | | | | | |_) |  __/ |     ___) |_____\__, |  | |\__, | (_) \__, |
|____/ \___|\___\___|_| |_| |_|_.__/ \___|_|    |____/        /_( ) |_|  /_/ \___/  /_/ 
                                                                |/                      

Message: 61629
Author: $ Bob Thornburg
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Daryl
Date: 12/02/89  Time: 17:35:41

Re:  "State a personal opinion, and get accused of
"bashing."

Hey!  That's what Apollo is all about.  State your personal opinion and
everybody chips in and tells you what is right and wrong with your head. 
I'll probably never hear the end of MLK.  And the guy's dead even!

Message: 61630
Author: $ Bob Thornburg
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Zak
Date: 12/02/89  Time: 17:39:36

Re:  "(If you doubt me, go to the library and see for yourself.)"

Not only do I doubt you, but I doubt Shakeman too.  I also doubt if I'll
bother to go to the library to check it out.  So what do you think of them
apples?

Message: 61631
Author: $ Bob Thornburg
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Zak
Date: 12/02/89  Time: 17:42:09

Re:  "The Constitution of the United States and the Bible have nothing in
common"

Why do you keep spouting all this kind of stuff?  If you don't want to
believe, it's ok with me.

Message: 61632
Author: $ Bob Thornburg
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Dog
Date: 12/02/89  Time: 17:54:49

Re:  "I feel that the legislature made a big mistake in not combining
Washington/Lincoln birthdays into President's day"

Actually we should do away with it all.  Im sure there is no one who doesn't
have some skeletons in their closet.  And we could dig up some dirt to make
them look bad.  I remember reading in a book somewhere that, "all have
sinned and fall short of the glory of God."

Message: 61633
Author: Mike Carter
Category: Answer!
Subject: Cliff on VOTE quest
Date: 12/02/89  Time: 19:09:03

 
Here's a question I'd like to see the >> Borland's new killer spreadsheet... QUATTRO-PRO ! <<<:
:                                                         :
:  QUATTRO-PRO, Borland's long anticipated update to their:
:  popular spreadsheet is out... and it just might be the :
:  best spreadsheet yet!  It combines the best features   :
:  of 1-2-3 and Excel, and then does more.  Linking files :
:  is a snap and the spreadsheet publishing capabilities  :
:  set new standards.  Now for the shocker... Quattro-Pro :
:  can run on a 512K PC!  Come see what Borland has done. :
LMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM9
: ALSO... THE MEMBERSHIP DRIVE GIVEAWAY DRAWING WILL TAKE :
:     PLACE, WITH HUNDREDS OF DOLLARS WORTH OF PRIZES!    :
LMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM9
:  This presentation should appeal to all users, and will :
:  NOT contain material that is "technical" in nature.    :
LMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM9
:   Bring your PC           7pm - Tuesday, Dec. 12th      :
:   questions!          Crescent Hotel - Dunlap & Freeway :
:                 (ask in lobby for info about exact room):

Message: 61728
Author: $ Zak Woodruff
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: CPI
Date: 12/06/89  Time: 04:52:59

You guys have convinced me that Caller Party Identification is OK.
 
According to a US West employee, there will be no option to not have your
number sent out.  This is because it *has* to be sent out when you dial 0,
1, or 911.  CPI is already being used for long distance, where your call is
being sent through several companies. 
 
US West will probably charge you to get the service.  So yes, we will have
to pay if we want to know what number is calling us.  Not to mention the
cost of new telephones with little digital displays.  Oh boy.
 
I'd still *prefer* it the way it is.

Message: 61729
Author: $ Zak Woodruff
Category: Religion
Subject: Paul Savage
Date: 12/06/89  Time: 05:02:35

Paul Savage is about to experience his six-hundred and sixty-sixth logon. 
He's on 664 right now.

Message: 61730
Author: $ Paul Savage
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Alan/phone
Date: 12/06/89  Time: 05:45:52

 I wonder when that began. I know it wasn't always that way. I will check
into it, and if it is an appreciable amount, I will have my number listed
from now on. I had it unlisted to avoid a lot of the telemarketing
harrassment and invasion of privacy, but now that they all use digital
dialing, I'm not missing much, so the unlisted # has probably outlived it's
intended purpose anyway.

Message: 61731
Author: $ Paul Savage
Category: Religion
Subject: Zak/last
Date: 12/06/89  Time: 05:56:15

 I'm not that heavy into numerology, so I don't think that logon 666 will
have any great cultural or moral shock value.
 Thanks for your obvious concern though. It's nice to have friends who care.

Message: 61732
Author: $ Ann Oudin
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Guns
Date: 12/06/89  Time: 09:39:43

Did Barney Fife constantly shoot his foot or was that purely accidental?
                   -=*) ANN (*=-

Message: 61733
Author: $ Apollo SYSOP
Category: The SYSOP Speaks
Subject: Backup
Date: 12/06/89  Time: 17:15:36

        I did a complete Hard Drive backup to 3.5 diskettes today.
This is new... before I had used 5 1/4 floppies and it took twice as many.

        This may make it easier for me as that means less disk swapping and
the 3.5 disks don't use a jacket.  less handling means less fumbling!

        Todays backup was just a test....  I still plan on doing it the 15th
and the 1st of each month...  Now, who will remind me?

*=* the 'Mighty' Apollo SYSOP *=*

Message: 61734
Author: $ Beauregard Dog
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Backups
Date: 12/06/89  Time: 17:51:40

Have Apollo remind you.

Message: 61735
Author: $ Bob Thornburg
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Zak
Date: 12/06/89  Time: 19:29:09

Re:{ "Let's get a few things straight:"

I'm glad you're willing to discuss these matters.

Message: 61736
Author: $ James Taranto
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Savage
Date: 12/06/89  Time: 20:05:45

Don't you think Woodruff deserves the "vivid imagination of the day award"?

Message: 61737
Author: $ James Taranto
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Woodruff
Date: 12/06/89  Time: 20:07:24

"Guns don't kill people, people kill people" means, obviously enough, that
guns are morally neutral, and people who use guns (or other means) to kill
bear the full moral responsibility for their act.  It's amazing that I have
to explain this to someone with as subtle a mind as yours.

Message: 61738
Author: Faith Winn
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: YOUNG ASTRONAUTS
Date: 12/06/89  Time: 21:03:55

YOUNG ASTRONAUTS HAS BEEN INTRODUCED TO 500,000 YOUNG STUDENTS IN 20,000
CLASSROOMS. YOUNG ASTRONAUTS IS A SPACE EDUCATIONAL PROGRAM THAT ENCOURAGES
IMPROVMENT OF MATHEMATICS, SCIENCE, AND CREATIVE THINKING. THIS PROGRAM
WORKS BEST IN THE CLASSROOM, BUT NOT ALL CHAPTERS ARE LINKED TO THE
CLASSROOM. SOME ARE COMBINED WITH GROUPS SUCH AS CAMP FIRE AND BOY
SCOUTS.THE YOUNG ASTRONAUTS PROGRAM IS THE PERFECT TEACHING TOOL. IT EXCITES
THE STUDENTS TO LEARN MORE MATH AND SCIENCE AND IT MAKES THOSE LESSONS FUN.
HAVING BEEN A YOUNG ASTRONAUT, I KNOW THIS PROGRAM WILL BE HELPFUL TO
TEACHERS,CLUB LEADERS, AND EVEN PARENTS. IF YOU WISH TO OBTAIN INFORMATIO ON
YOUNG ASTRONAUTS,PLEASE WRITE TO: YOUNG ASTRONAUT COUNCIL, P.O. BOX
65432,WASHINGTON,D.C.20036. OR IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, I WOULD BE MORE
THAN HAPPY TO ANSWER THEM.

Message: 61739
Author: $ James Taranto
Category: Question?
Subject: FAITH WINN
Date: 12/06/89  Time: 22:19:40

CAN YOU TALK A LITTLE LOUDER?  I CAN'T HEAR YOU.

Message: 61740
Author: $ James Hawley
Category: Answer!
Subject: LAST
Date: 12/07/89  Time: 00:28:39

EH, WHATYA SAY?

Message: 61741
Author: $ Peter Petrisko
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: SLOGAN
Date: 12/07/89  Time: 01:45:12

"Stupid people aren't stupid, stupid people are."

Message: 61742
Author: $ Zak Woodruff
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Taranto61737
Date: 12/07/89  Time: 04:08:49

I know that!  Why wouldn't I know that?
 
Is it me?  It's him, right?
 

Message: 61743
Author: $ Zak Woodruff
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Thornburg
Date: 12/07/89  Time: 04:16:39

I sincerely hope that your comment about being glad I'm willing to discuss
things wasn't SARCASTIC!  Because, Bob, my "let's get things straight"
comment was just me being cocky.  Ever since I got those awards, I can't
help myself.
 
In any case, I'm willing to discuss the ACLU if you are.  I'd like to know
what it is about the ACLU that would result in your need to mention them
negatively every other post.  I also would like to hear some rational
arguments about the Constitution being based on the Bible, and our founding
fathers being Bible-thumping Christians.
 
But you know that.

Message: 61745
Author: $ Paul Savage
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: JT on Zak
Date: 12/07/89  Time: 06:24:53

 Perhaps the "vivid imagination of the year" award! I doubt that anyone
could top his scenarios!

Message: 61746
Author: $ Paul Savage
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Faith Winn
Date: 12/07/89  Time: 06:26:34

 Please stop shouting! It's too early in the morning for all that noise!
(In other words, don't you have lower case ability? 'Twould be easier to
read.)
Gee, thanks.

Message: 61747
Author: $ Apollo SYSOP
Category: Apollo Tips & Tricks
Subject: [L>ibrary [S>cmd
Date: 12/07/89  Time: 08:18:21

        It amazes me when users look for new files in the [L>ibrary, they
list ALL 232 [F>iles available for [D>ownloading.  More users should learn
how to use the [S>earch cmd and let the computer do some of the work for
you.   A good Tip to look at new files might be to do a [S>earch on current
year, since I always include the date a file is [U>ploaded.   I use the
format 'MM/DD/YY' you would ask for '/YY'....

        As in:  Enter [S> and return key.  Then when it askes you for the
Search string, Enter '/89' to look up files added to the [L>ibrary in 1989.

        You can also [S>earch on any part of the description, computer type,
or who uploaded it.

I hope this helps someone....

*=* the 'Mighty' Apollo SYSOP *=*

Message: 61748
Author: $ Dean Hathaway
Category: Get-Togethers (GTs)
Subject: Music GT
Date: 12/07/89  Time: 08:45:02

  I am hosting a music GT at my house (1309 E. Shangri La Rd, PHX) on Friday
December 8th at 7pm. We will have some snack food and pop (mostly diet) and
you can feel free to bring anything or nothing else that you may want. We
are equipped to play CDs, audio cassettes, records, and VHS video tapes.
  The phone number is 943-7447.
    See You Later,
       Dean H.

Message: 61749
Author: $ Ann Oudin
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Faith
Date: 12/07/89  Time: 09:37:23

Please turn off your shouting! -=*) ANN (*=-

Message: 61750
Author: $ Joe Bottomlee
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: CPN
Date: 12/07/89  Time: 14:27:33

For U S West to have the CPN feature avaiable it will take some major
hardware changes and a software upgrade. They will also have to purchase a
speical feature package. The last I heard, which was just a few days ago,
Arizona branch of U S West was not going to purchase the feature package
that CPN requires. They are going to do the hardware changes and software
upgrade, but for another reason, money. It will save them money by reducing
the number of trunks they need between offices. The way a call to another
office is handle now a trunk path is set up even if the call can not be
completed at the other end. When the changes are made the orignating office
will know the other line is available before the trunk path is set up. Some
of you might understand what I mean by all this, others may not, but feel
free to ask me questions. I will try to answer them. Even though I work on
the equipment I don't know everything about all the in and outs of it.
 
                               <<< Joe >>>

Message: 61751
Author: Roger Mann
Category: Religion
Subject: One true god
Date: 12/07/89  Time: 16:07:02

I believe that the one true religion is Zoroastrianism. You can find the
church office number under Z in the business white pages. I think they
think that Thursday is the Sabbath and are therefore also known as the
Fourth Day Adventists, thus lending credence to the rumor that the Food
and Drug Administration is a secret agency of an international conspiracy
with its roots in ancient Babylon.

(And you know who is behind international terrorism, don't you?) Yup.
Ancient Babylon.

Message: 61752
Author: $ Apollo SYSOP
Category: In search of
Subject: Mark Adkins?
Date: 12/07/89  Time: 17:12:37

        Where did he go?   I was enjoying his posts....  Sniff (tm)

*=* the 'Mighty' Apollo SYSOP *=*

Message: 61753
Author: $ Bob Thornburg
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Zak
Date: 12/07/89  Time: 21:34:06

Sometimes I think you like to pick on me.  Was it something I said?  More
than half the things I post on Apollo are strictly tongue-in-cheek.  I guess
the ACLU has done some good things, but I don't know what they are.  I don't
think I bad mouth them every other post.  Maybe every other 3rd post.  Ha! 
So what have they done lately that makes you proud of the ACLU?  I don't
think the founding fathers of the Constitution were Bible-thumpers.  Why
would you think that?  Lets talk about something fun.  The following
subjects are not fun:
MLK
ACLU
Christian bashing

Message: 61754
Author: $ James Hawley
Category: Answer!
Subject: Cliff
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 01:13:54

I heard that Jeff Beck was on tour.

Message: 61755
Author: $ Zak Woodruff
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Thornbob
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 03:29:04

Bob, I'm not picking *on* you, I'm picking *with* you.
 
The ACLU has done plenty of good stuff.  It has fought for free speech,
against censorship, and for civil rights, for example.  In the 1930s it
opposed the censorship of James Joyce's _Ulysses_.  In 1954 it aided the
victory of the "Brown v. Board of Education of Topeka," a landmark case that
made segregation in public schools illegal.  The ACLU tries to
defend the Bill of Rights, and this has led them to defend even the free
speech and free assembly rights of Nazis and Communists.  What they are
saying is, "Even if we don't like what a group has to say, we should defend
their right to say it."  The ACLU fought for pro-choice and helped in the
"Roe v. Wade" case.  (To you, that's bad, but not to me.)
     They've also made their share of bad decisions.
 
You're right that you didn't say the founding fathers were Christians.  Paul
and Cliff were saying that.  The reason I want to discuss these things is
that I want to know why people believe in them.  If there are good reasons,
I'd like to hear them and maybe I'll change my mind.  But the usual response
to "Put up or shut up" lately seems to be to shut up, as also with the "The
Constitution is based on the Bible" statement.  Either nobody wants to talk
about this and defend it, or nobody can defend it.  In any case, it's
irritating to me, though I probably shouldn't let it be.
 
You listed topics that aren't any fun; how about listing some that are?

Message: 61756
Author: $ Zak Woodruff
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Where's Jeff?
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 03:38:03

10 to 1 says that he's Roger Mann.

Message: 61757
Author: $ Paul Savage
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Joe/cpn
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 05:47:12

 As untechnical and unelectronical minded as I am, you could use up all of
Cliff'S HD storage space to expain the phenomenon of how this cpn system
works, and I probably wouldn't understand any more at the end than I did at
the beginning. I'm just amazed that things like this can even be done, and
don'T worry too much about the how.
 Is there any ballpark idea of what such a thing would cost the consumer
who wants to use this service?
 THanks for the offer of information, Joe. It is appreciated.

Message: 61758
Author: $ Paul Savage
Category: Answer!
Subject: Zak
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 05:57:52

 I never said that all of the founding fathers were Christians, Zak. Such a
statement could too easily be disproved, since in fact, they weren't.
 What I have said is that the Constitution, and basically all laws, are
Bible based, since the principles for which these papers were written are
basically those principles which were laid out in the Bible years before.
 If you were to research documents through the ages, using the law of first
mention, you would find that many of he precepts on which this country was
founded (basically freedoms of religion, thought, expression, etc.) were
first found in the pages of Holy Scripture.
 Again, if you look at the basic laws that govern mankind, especially in the
U.S., it is not difficult to see a foundation in God's laws as they were
laid out in Exodus and Leviticus in the Bible. Simply put, when it comes to
laws governing our actions and interactions with our fellow man, God
probably said it first. 
 If you have an argument with that, may I suggest a careful reading of the
Old Testament law, and then that you take up any problems you may have with
God, not Cliff or me?

Message: 61759
Author: $ Beauregard Dog
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Zak's odds
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 08:42:57

I'll bet $10 that he isn't, Zak.  Any other takers?

Message: 61760
Author: $ Beauregard Dog
Category: Entertainment/Movies
Subject: Sequels
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 10:39:27

Don't you think that movie sequels are out of control?  They just finished
filming, on location at a university in Montreal, the final scenes for Fatal
Attraction II: The Mass Murder.

Message: 61761
Author: Roger Mann
Category: In search of
Subject: 61752/Mark Adkins?
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 12:29:34

I called Mark the other day after he disappeared from CarolCom and Mensa. He
said he was spending 3 hours a day on BBS (being clever ain't easy) and was
working on another project that involved an Amiga. He would be back after
a while.

Message: 61762
Author: Roger Mann
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: 61756/Where's Jeff?
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 12:32:52

Sorry, you lose. I am flattered by the comparison, but quite frankly I don't
have the wetware thesaurus that Mark(Jeff) carries around with him. 

Message: 61763
Author: $ Beauregard Dog
Category: Answer!
Subject: Zak's wager
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 13:03:00

Pay up!

Message: 61764
Author: $ Apollo SYSOP
Category: The SYSOP Speaks
Subject: HD Relief
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 14:00:20

        This is the same post as before, but I am adding three more users to
the list...  Shirley Bear, Beauregard Dog and James Hawley....

        I wish to thank Nick Ianuzzi, Ann Oudin and Dan Derwin for the
H-D Relief.  It sure helped ease some of the $marts...

        This was beyond the call of duty!

        And everything seems to be working just fine... (-;}

                        Happy Holidays!

*=* the 'Mighty' Apollo SYSOP *=*

Message: 61765
Author: $ Jim Lippard
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Bible-based law
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 17:21:37

Sorry, the foundations are Lockean/Hobbesian natural law as revealed by
human reason, not biblical revelation.  See, e.g., _The Moral Foundations of
the American Republic_, edited by Robert H. Horwitz (1986, University Press
of Virginia).
   And anyway, the Old Testament stole its basic laws from the Babylonians.

Message: 61766
Author: $ Jim Lippard
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: ACLU
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 17:24:55

The ACLU came to the defense of Oliver North.  A nice list of good things
they have done may be found in the article "The ACLU:  Suspicious
Principles, Salutary Effects" by William P. Moulton, Liberty magazine May
1988, pp. 29-34.  Some of the court cases include giving teachers the right
to teach foreign languages in Iowa schools, ensuring that Indians could vote
in New Mexico, allow people to perform electrical work in Philadelphia even
if they live outside the city, allow people to give poetry readings in NYC
without a license, etc. etc.

Message: 61767
Author: Mark Story
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: DOGMA
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 17:51:04

Mr. Savage ...
I quite enjoyed your expressions about th e Catholic church ....
I currently haven't the time to correspond/expound ... but am looking 
forward to brainstorm on the subject also ....
keep thinking clearly and loving God 
Talk to you soon !
Mark Story

Message: 61768
Author: $ Gary Jones
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: New Status Members
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 19:24:53

Welcome to the New Status members of Apollo.  Hope you'll enter into our
zany world, and give and take with the rest of us.  Just remember, we don't
get angry, we just get **even**.

                                                   ****  Gary   ****

Message: 61769
Author: $ Bob Thornburg
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Zak
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 19:50:18

Re:  "It has fought for free speech, against censorship"

Beauty is truly in the eye of the beholder.  From my point of view, the ACLU
has done more to unleash porn than any other group I know of.  They are not
for free speech; they are for flooding the minds of our youth with porn. 
This is their idea of free speech.

Re:  "You're right that you didn't say the founding fathers were
Christians."

I didn't say that.  I think most of the founding fathers are Christians. 
You said before something about them being Bible thumpers.  There is quite a
difference.  Maybe to you all Christians are Bible thumpers.  That would
explain a lot of your attitude.

Re:  "You listed topics that aren't any fun; how about listing some that
are?"

I like to talk about the Bible.  I really enjoy that.  I like to talk about
computers, electronics, and related things.

Message: 61770
Author: $ Bob Thornburg
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Jim
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 19:55:06

Re:  "The ACLU came to the defense of Oliver North."

Did they really?  That's the first I've heard of it.  If they really did,
then I must confess, the ACLU has done at least one thing I like.

Message: 61771
Author: $ Apollo SYSOP
Category: Get-Togethers (GTs)
Subject: Music at Hathaways..
Date: 12/08/89  Time: 21:19:38

        Sorry I was unable to attend the fun and music with the rest of you
happy GT goers.  Sandy and I are just too down under the weather to sing
along with you tonight in person.  Have a toast (with Pepsi) wishing for the
SysOpette and SysOp's recovery from what ever ails them.  (ain't no fun)
        
        This all probably makes Mr Williams very happy... ha ha haha.. Gag!

Cheers to the gang at Hathaways place!

*=* the 'Xxxxxx' Apollo SysOp *=*

Message: 61772
Author: $ Zak Woodruff
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Paul
Date: 12/09/89  Time: 05:42:22

That's just it.  The Bible isn't the first book to state laws.  If you go
back several hundred years to the Code of Hammurabi, you'll see that they
had a list of laws similar to the 10 Commandments.  Obviously they weren't
based on the OT, but the other way around.
     
 
Does the bible guarantee free speech, the right to trial by jury, freedom of
religion, etc?  I don't think so.  I don't know the bible that well, but I
remember something about worshipping "no other gods before me."  Doesn't
sound like freedom of religous practice.  I'd like to see some OT quotes
that show the similarities between the Bible and Constitution.

Message: 61773
Author: $ Zak Woodruff
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Bob/pornography
Date: 12/09/89  Time: 05:51:57

     On pornography:  I wouldn't say that the ACLU's motive for defending
pornography is "to fill the minds of our youth with porn."  This is
obviously not the case; the ACLU have never fought for pornography to be
available to minors.
     The ACLU do have genuinely valid motives.  The point is that all
contending ideas, no matter how absurd or repulsive, deserve the right to be
expressed.  ACLU Legislative Director Barry Lynn defends pornography on
these grounds:  the ideas pornography reflects have been around a long time
and are therefore serious ideas.  "A fundamental argument of pornography,"
Lynn said, "is that women ought to be subjugated.  Now, that is an idea
which has held sway in much of the world for the last two thousand years, or
even longer [the Bible included].  It is certainly and important idea, even
though it is an idea we as a society are coming to repudiate.  But it is a
serious idea, and not an idea which ought to be suppressed."
 

Message: 61774
Author: $ Zak Woodruff
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Beauregard Dog
Date: 12/09/89  Time: 05:57:40

     Oooh, ah...I don't have the money right now.  Can I pay you some time
in the near future?  Is the 15th a good day?

Message: 61775
Author: $ Paul Savage
Category: Religion
Subject: Zak
Date: 12/09/89  Time: 06:29:37

 The Bible really has a lot to say about freedoms and law, etc. In fact, in
one passage, it deals with the fruit of the Spirit, which is love, joy,
peace, longsuffering, goodness, mercy and faith, and indicates that those
who live by them need no law, since there is no law against such things.
This is true freedom. THe freedom to live according to God's love, and to
show it toward others. If all people did that,we would have no need for
laws, or for enforcement, or for prisons, or for such as the ACLU. (The
latter of which I feel that we have no need for now.)

Message: 61776
Author: $ Ann Oudin
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Beau/that movie
Date: 12/09/89  Time: 08:21:23

How can they make a sequel to Fatal Attraction? She dies at the end. Is
Michael Douglas in this one too? Maybe they turned her into another Jason.
                              -=*) ANN (*=-

Message: 61777
Author: $ Ann Oudin
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Cliff
Date: 12/09/89  Time: 08:23:21

Who is Shirley Bear? We have another woman on the board? Is she a new
member? Please tell here to reveal herself. -=*) ANN (*=-

Message: 61778
Author: $ Ann Oudin
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Porn
Date: 12/09/89  Time: 08:27:23

I think this is a good time for some of you to give your definition of what
'Porn' is and isn't! Could be interesting. Any comments? -=*) ANN (*=-

Message: 61779
Author: $ Ann Oudin
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Paul/last/list
Date: 12/09/89  Time: 08:30:22

I can go along with your list - love, joy, peace, etc, but NOT
longsuffering! That doesn't make a bit of sense. What is 'true freedom' got
to do with that or the need for laws? -=*) ANN (*=-

Message: 61780
Author: $ Apollo SYSOP
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: ACLU/Kiddie porn
Date: 12/09/89  Time: 10:05:34

        Re: Zak "The ACLU has never fought to make porn available to minors"

A quote from the ACLU "Laws which punish the distribution of such materials
to minors violate the 1st Amendment"

        The ACLU thinks the distribution and sale of all pornography should
be made legal, even so-called "kiddie porn" which depicts small children
engaging in sexual intercourse. 
                Daniel J. Popeo  Washington Legal Foundation.